Trumtram

considering about an hour of material (therefore an hour long setlist) the price is in no way justified.

what??? that's damn expensive! have to overthink my attendence...

haha, no! but i see how one might understand it that way . the US is a much bigger country and while bands, that come over here to europe, normally tour around germany (mostly: berlin, hamburg, cologne/düsseldorf, munich) and cover all directions because germany is like 800km to 600km in size, americans get ditched all the time. even smaller american bands get anywhere near SOMETHING big in germany while smaller bands in the US often can't get over their state or tour their neighbour at max. so, if schoecknlgdssd-guy (sorry, can't get it right right now ) complains about a 1 1/2 hour drive (or less than an hour train travel!!!) than he should rather be happy to not live in big america. hope that clears the fog

oh come on! as if cologne would be THAT far away... should be lucky to not live in the US i'll be at the cologne show for sure. prices won't be too high, so call me in.

i stopped collecting them after the 2007 summer shows. they all sound the same (except for minor differences) and it's more than enough to get hold of the different setlists. having them just for having them is stupid. everyone who listens to all of them or needs them for reference should pick them up, sure. so, these DSP news don't get me excited at all .

just to add something to the setlist talk. they lost an attender in me because i'm not willing to pay money for the same songs over and over. i didn't go to a single show when they came here earlier this year. i'm not even hyped to see them again after the new album release. and mark: the label has more power than you might think. another example for this is "enter shikari". they literally hate to play songs like "sorry, you're not a winner" and "mothership" but said something along the lines "but yeah, we have to play them, that's how the business runs". they were bored to hell and had almost no energy while playing these songs. the big shows in arenas and stuff are planned for the largest amount of people possible. you can only achieve a good level of satisfaction within the crowd if you play the well known stuff. if the band REALLY wanted to do what they want, they wouldn't play quite a few songs anymore (including "one step closer", "crawling" and "in the end" probably). i really don't think they still do them for fan pleasing, that's a shiny excuse.

thank you for elaborating on this. my thought was that he, as 1/6 of the band, has to be around for all the decisions of what sounds good, what could be changed and so on during the process. wasn't aware that he gets that rare when it comes to the studio...

which you can prove with facts than just pure assumption, right?

if it really is something around these kinds i'll die in endless amazement. seriously mark, i would be thankful forever and that would truly be one hell of an release.im stoked now, damnit!!!!

sure thing, but BTH does not fall in this rewrite category im refering to. mike tried to write this song for 5 years, but what does that mean? did he want to write a song about this theme or did he have a melody in mind and couldn't form it right. either way does not fall in the endless rewriting scheme. having an IDEA and work on that one afterwards is a totally good thing. but linkin park talks about whole songs. rewriting whole songs might lead to good things but still won't specifically lead to a better song, just to another one. there is always a reason for the creation of a song in the first place and by constantly changing and reworking every aspect this reason gets lost.

i gave up caring about their way of working because i got too many much greater bands in my playlist that take up all my time right now . my point was trying to show EVERYBODY the fact, that good things don't have to take long. im so tired of reading "better they take more time and make the album better than rush it and make it bad". best things come out under pressure. and i agree with "untitled" and "in the end". this example came up when i was in bed .

songs have to be "perfect" to be great. so what is perfect? is it perfect when a song gets so much work done that it sounds dead? or is it perfect if you get the song the way it FEELS perfect?you can write the greatest songs of all time in one day, yes you heard me. while searching for the so called "perfection" you will rewrite that song and this way its dozen of forms that would've have been as good as the final product if not better. redoing everything is no guarentee to make a song better, that's a fact. you, as an artist, might like it better and that's all that counts in the end, sure. but, to repeat myself: there is NO connection of the time you need to make an album and it's final "quality", ABSOLUTELY NO! you can sit down for an hour and write a song, listen to it and like it, maybe work a bit on it and absolutely love it. when you listen to it again, you might see that EVERY change you do (even replaying the riff because you made a MISTAKE) will kill the feel of the song. linkin park rewrote "somewhere i belong" endless times, and even though we don't know the older versions, there is almost no way of them being any worse. linkin park's rob bordon rehearsed the drum's for "the little things give you away" countless hours and they kept the demo drums. again, we don't know how the final song would sound if they've used the rerecorded version, but in the lp community this song is widely known as one of linkin park's absolutely best songs. if every artist would use the definition of perfection in the sense of making it SOUND perfect, than there wouldn't be many many many too many amazing songs, classics. a song has to FEEL perfect and therefore you don't have to rewrite it all the time. just making it SOUND better will never make it any more perfect. think about it.

there is by no means a positive correlation between duration of writing/recording process and quality of the final output. i really hope people would get this.

japan??? that is beyond amazing! i never ever thought that this song came far in the process and really wanted to hear this song the most judging from the dvd clip !

could be, sure. in the end it's one of mike's songs, so he truely could know about every version that got released on the internet. let's rephrase: out of all these demos "sad" could most likely be a version of "by myself" that we already have. the others are unreleased for sure. though, a papercut demo would be a dream. that's the only small complain but not worth a real mention .

can't remember any tracklist that got released before hand that was wrong. release dates are a different chapter. but as for the actual tracklist they were always right (as far as i know). really love the tracklist btw. im not too positive about "by myself" being a demo that we don't already have (considering we have what? 4-5? haha) because i highly doubt mike knows of every version that is out there. but even without "sad" it's something to really look forward to! thx LPU that you got it right after 3 years of irony.

how lame is it to even participate in the first place?

rob chat = epic fail (usually) reason to join? really not at all. sorry i dont think we will get ONE useful information and im sure im not the only one who thinks that.

"hybrid theory" is one of the last few reasons to actually still follow linkin park. this album did too much for me that i never could reject the band. for me it's still the best of their albums and i can't even decide whether the polished (overall) junk, called "meteora", or "minutes to boredom" follows on the second place. not to mention the two pathetic live dvd attempts. "collision course" was original, but FAR overpriced. still it's a good EP! in the end the only thing nearly close to the greatness of "hybrid theory" might be the so titled EP. if they could create such dark musical and lyrical environments again, i would be more than pleased.

it cant be phoenix 2nd angle version, because that one isn't listed as confirmend in the live guide. for god's sake, now im right in the guessing game. damn you all!

every show past 2002 is no reason for me to flip or even download. but that's just me i guess .

summersonic and smokeout would be great, but it's nothing to flip out. this huge announcement states something oldschool. but i wont participate any further on the guessing game because its ridiculous. we wont get any more information on the show, so why bother?

used - failETF - epic fail so, no!

i would love a pm of the studio, too

this is the nerdiest thread ever thx anyway!