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JZLP-AmendsUltimateFan

#HT20 What's missing and what's unnecessary?

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I think that the people who were in charge of creating the tracklists of the albums were a bit lazy and probably didn't even know about every demo that's out there. 

 

85% of the album feels like a compilation of some singles 

 

I still can't believe that we got like 7 versions of POA, wow. Very unnecessary. 

 

They could have use tracks from the 6 track demo and also throw in there some Reanimation demos too. 

 

 

 

 

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Would have loved Chester's full audition tape as it's own separate album/cassette.

 

The Team Sleep remix of My December would have been nice. Even if it's truly not that good, it could have taken the spot of one of the 8 total versions of POA.

 

We definitely didn't need as many versions of POA as we got.

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2 hours ago, lpfan12 said:

man all that don't even matter. they didn't have to do this bruh

You are right man, why would they had to celebrate the 20th anniversary of one of the best selling records of all time? 

 

😶

Edited by JZLP-AmendsUltimateFan

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There were a lot of things missing or that I wished we got in a different or complete format:

1. Complete, separate releases for the early tape recordings, including the 3- and 4-track Xero tapes and the audition tape

2. Chester's audition recordings (of course!)

3. The 2-track HT demo with the iconic red artwork

5. Seeing that concept artwork was made for the 8-track demo with She Couldn't, I wish we had gotten a proper release for this demo CD complete with the artwork

6.  With You demos and the second Dust Brothers track

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The only thing I'm really missing on here is the Part Of Me with the prechorus screaming. Besides that (and some technical issues on the LPU disc) I'm super happy with the box set we got.

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Missing - Instrumentals from Hybrid Theory and Reanimation. Unnecessary - hmm maybe few live audios from Docklands Arena.

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Some of this stuff you guys are suggesting has zero commercial value. I understand that a 20th anniversary box set is going to be aimed more towards diehards than the general public, but this stuff still has to, you know, sell. Making a $200 box set with stuff that's way too niche, or something insanely sprawling with every single potential variation of every HT track, isn't worth the cost. Especially when you drill down into some of these demos and think about how different they really are.

 

The 6-track demo, for instance, has nothing substantially different from the demos we did end up getting. A replica of the 8-track demo, sure, maybe, given how directly it was acknowledged in the artbook, but all of those tracks are basically in this box anyway, plus now you're cutting some tracks out onto a separate CD, which pops up the manufacturing cost and makes each CD even sparser in terms of content. The exact versions from the 8-track? Not in every case, no, but putting 400 demos of every HT track in a box set like this is a waste of time for everyone but the .01% of the fanbase on this forum. The focus seemed to be on getting the really big variants onto this box - the LPU and Forgotten versions of Points are both distinct from the HT version, Carousel obviously has a very different vibe, SuperXero is different enough, Crawling has the rap bridge that changes the whole flow of the song. You compare those to what's not on here - Plaster variations, Dust Brothers, other alts of the songs that did make the cut - and you see that there's a threshold the demos had to meet to justify making the box. Part of Me feels like the only valid omission, which people have been saying for months. No one was upset that Plaster (mix 1 of 4) missed out.

 

As for the Xero tape, it would have been nice to have the whole thing in the quality of RME. But look at what did make it - a professional studio recording of Rhinestone, the Chester version of Stick N Move, which, based on how the guys talk about that song, seems like the only version they can even stand. Fuse was out of the question from the start because of the sample and the inability to cut it out of the master track, so once you've broken up the tape, there's no reason to include an inferior version of Rhinestone and a version of Stick N Move they hate. That takes a physical reproduction of the Xero tape off the table.

 

A reproduction of the 2-track HT demo would be redundant, but including just the sticker I could have seen being a nice addition. Chester's audition tape seems pretty unrealistic at this point - that's something the band will hold close to their hearts forever, and I'd be surprised if it ever, ever, EVER sees any official release. Maybe they think it's too close to commercializing Chester. Maybe they just want to keep something private, the way so little of the HT era is. Either way, I'm champing at the bit for it, but I doubt we'll ever see it.

 

This box was not and never was about emptying the vaults. This box was about taking the entire Hybrid Theory era and summing it up for the big fans and for people who weren't even alive when HT came out. It's a convenient way to bundle up all those b-sides (a bunch of which do have actual value despite the denigration of live tracks in general - can't tell me those Docklands tracks don't rip, though I could take or leave the BBC ones), to open up the LPU vault for people who missed out and don't have the savvy to find those tracks elsewhere, and even after all that, they STILL threw us some bones with four tracks none of us had ever heard, and audio upgrades for the rest. Given the way the HT era has been mined to death in this fanbase, it's shocking to me that there was ANYTHING we had no clue about.

 

More cynically, the Chester vault is finite. Warner will never get new material from Chester ever again. Emptying the vault, even for a major anniversary like this, is an unwise move. That audition tape is absolute gold, and they'll hold onto that until the end of time, I'll bet.

 

I know this probably sounds like I'm some Warner shill, but we need to have some perspective about things like this. There are plenty of valid criticisms - the EU manufacturing errors in particular are outrageous, the weird way the vinyl was split between the big box and the vinyl box is pure money-grubbing by Warner, DVDs in 2020 are just goofy - but it is, actually, true that Warner didn't have to put this much effort. Tons of labels will just chuck out an anniversary release like the 2CD version and call it quits. The band put real care into this box, you can tell that they had a ton of input into what made it in, and they really did crack open the vault in a way I wasn't expecting. In a way, nothing will ever be enough, and I don't mean that in a derogatory way towards anyone - it's natural to want more from your favorite band in the world. I just think we need to have some more perspective on what we actually got, rather than what we didn't.

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35 minutes ago, gorast said:

Chester's audition tape seems pretty unrealistic at this point - that's something the band will hold close to their hearts forever, and I'd be surprised if it ever, ever, EVER sees any official release. Maybe they think it's too close to commercializing Chester. Maybe they just want to keep something private, the way so little of the HT era is.

I thought about this after I posted about how I wish it had been included, and I actually do think this could be the reason. That tape was the first time they heard Chester's voice on their music. They may want to keep that to themselves and not feel like they're exploiting his memory too much. If Chester were still here, maybe they would have been more inclined to include that. Or maybe not. We'll never know.

 

It's also possible that the band would be cool with it but Warner chose to hold it back because they want to keep that up their sleeve for something in the future. That's a more cynical possibility, but it wouldn't be unheard of. Most huge bands do have things in the vault that will either never come out or literally might be decades before they're released... This might sound like a joke but there's a non-zero chance that HT50 will be a thing in 2050. Chester's audition tape would have even more value at that point, and I would buy it IMMEDIATELY even though I would be 59 years old at that point lol.

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4 hours ago, Justin said:

I thought about this after I posted about how I wish it had been included, and I actually do think this could be the reason. That tape was the first time they heard Chester's voice on their music. They may want to keep that to themselves and not feel like they're exploiting his memory too much. If Chester were still here, maybe they would have been more inclined to include that. Or maybe not. We'll never know.

 

It's also possible that the band would be cool with it but Warner chose to hold it back because they want to keep that up their sleeve for something in the future. That's a more cynical possibility, but it wouldn't be unheard of. Most huge bands do have things in the vault that will either never come out or literally might be decades before they're released... This might sound like a joke but there's a non-zero chance that HT50 will be a thing in 2050. Chester's audition tape would have even more value at that point, and I would buy it IMMEDIATELY even though I would be 59 years old at that point lol.

Imagine being that age (I’d be 58 at that time) and listening to the first ever approach to LP by your hero who passed away more than 30 years prior ...wow bittersweet 

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Also maybe they never even thought of releasing it, cause Chester wouldn't have liked it.

LP has always been close to their fanbase, so that could already have been in the spokes, but maybe Chester didn't like the idea when he was alive - it would be hella disrespectful to release the if e.g. this was the case.

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11 hours ago, PurpleFlinstoneVitamins92 said:

Imagine being that age (I’d be 58 at that time) and listening to the first ever approach to LP by your hero who passed away more than 30 years prior ...wow bittersweet 

Beatles fans have gone through stuff like that with John Lennon before with demos being released and things like that decades after his death. Obviously I wasn’t alive when he was but I saw how it was bittersweet for my grandparents who were fans back in the day.

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8 minutes ago, Justin said:

Beatles fans have gone through stuff like that with John Lennon before with demos being released and things like that decades after his death. Obviously I wasn’t alive when he was but I saw how it was bittersweet for my grandparents who were fans back in the day.

Yeah same for my mom, she is a huge Lennon fan. 

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I would've loved to have Cure for the Itch back with its initial outro (like on the Unmastered CD) seguing into High Voltage as one track or back-to-back.

Then of course the entire Xero tape in the same quality as for RME.

A CD with the entire Docklands live audio, assuming the video is lost in its proper quality.

KROQ Almost Acoustic 2001, because of the acoustic performance bit.

Hybrid Theory instrumentals + acapellas

Reanimation instrumentals + acapellas

 

Also maybe it'd be nice to have something exclusive to the LPU, that is still tied to HT20 celebration.

So far, I feel like the LPU peeps, who still pay for it to support them were totally neglected in the whole scheme of events.

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I feel there's issues but it's definitely a higher-end package. Few bands are willing to put this much effort into something like this. If it wasn't for Warner screwing up shipping and production it would be perfect, in my opinion.

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