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What's After "Pictureboard"? Discussing Linkin Park's "Holy Grail" Cuts

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3 hours ago, hahninator said:

Mike said Reading My Eyes was never re recorded with Chester. 
 

That's so sad. It's amazing song.

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34 minutes ago, Coizu said:

Well I guess Mike might have just mentioned a new holy grail? 😄 

https://clips.twitch.tv/ResilientMagnificentElkAMPTropPunch

I'm done calling Holy Grails to Xero songs or demos

 

Most of the stuff is bad and it's worth listening only for historical reasons. 

 

A holy grail for me would be a song that is totally finished..

 

 

 

 

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3 minutes ago, JZLP-AmendsUltimateFan said:

Most of the stuff is bad and it's worth listening only for historical reasons. 

 

 

I agree with that sentence but for me personally a historic song gets a more "holy grail" status compared to any other random song that might be finished but I guess everyone sees that a little bit different. In general I think the concept of "holy grail" is not really worth it anyway. We get whatever we get, it makes no sense to seek for one specific thing in my opinion.

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So Deaftest? here we go again, see you guys in 20 years.

The weird thing is that he dropped the name of the track like it was include on the Forgotten Demos Cd or something lol

Edited by Diaux

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Thinking that "holy grail" material is about quality is missing the point. It's about digging out pieces of LP history that we hear about, things we can latch onto the broaden our understanding of the band. IMO, it doesn't matter that Pictureboard isn't the greatest song of all time or even really all that great - it's all about the mystery, the intrigue of this lost track that was mysteriously played once, that they did with Mark.

 

Sometimes it feels like people intentionally misconstrue what the goal is here. No one's out here saying "Mark is better than Chester," "Mark's vocals have value because he's good," or any dumb shit like that. Obviously Mark is nothing compared to Chester, but isn't it enticing to hear material from an extremely young band, back when they basically had no clue what they were doing? If you love a band so much, it's only natural to want to see the whole timeline. The fervor when it comes to Mark material, I think, is further amplified simply because it's different - because it's not Chester, it's this other guy who was there first, who moved on. The Xero tracks have seeds of what LP became, but a lot of them are so different, and it's extremely intriguing to me to get more and more of that material. It's exciting, you know? And then, it's thrilling to imagine a Stick N Move scenario, where a Mark song survived long enough to become a Chester song, and then you can compare them, hear the evolution in real time.

 

That's what annoyed me so much about this bizarre anti-Mark crowd - it's not about Mark vs. Chester, it's about hearing this wildly different permutation of a band we all love. It's entirely about the history, and that's the whole point. Don't get it twisted.

 

To pop back on topic, that 3-track pre-Xero tape sampler is the new grail IMO, if only to hear Deaftest and see what that one's about. Dialate and RME are probably the same as what we've already heard, but I want to see the artwork, if there is any. That feels like something that will never, ever come out secondhand, though. There might have always only been single or double digit copies of it in existence, and those are almost certainly all gone now.

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18 hours ago, gorast said:

Thinking that "holy grail" material is about quality is missing the point. It's about digging out pieces of LP history that we hear about, things we can latch onto the broaden our understanding of the band. IMO, it doesn't matter that Pictureboard isn't the greatest song of all time or even really all that great - it's all about the mystery, the intrigue of this lost track that was mysteriously played once, that they did with Mark.

 

Sometimes it feels like people intentionally misconstrue what the goal is here. No one's out here saying "Mark is better than Chester," "Mark's vocals have value because he's good," or any dumb shit like that. Obviously Mark is nothing compared to Chester, but isn't it enticing to hear material from an extremely young band, back when they basically had no clue what they were doing? If you love a band so much, it's only natural to want to see the whole timeline. The fervor when it comes to Mark material, I think, is further amplified simply because it's different - because it's not Chester, it's this other guy who was there first, who moved on. The Xero tracks have seeds of what LP became, but a lot of them are so different, and it's extremely intriguing to me to get more and more of that material. It's exciting, you know? And then, it's thrilling to imagine a Stick N Move scenario, where a Mark song survived long enough to become a Chester song, and then you can compare them, hear the evolution in real time

 

Huge post. It's been years since I've really sat down and listened to most of these demos, and of course hearing these new demos really put everything into perspective. Looking through the picture book was a really interesting experience; I am around the same age now as they were when they were forming Xero and recording these demos, and I have much the same aspirations as them. It was a very unique feeling looking and listening into the past. 2020 is my 20th anniversary too :P so at least for me, the intrinsic quality of the songs isn't as important as the history they hold.

 

Stick N' Move does go kinda off tho

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I know Mike would know what "Xero Reborn's" actual demo name is. We should ask him what the actual name of the demo is.

 

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29 minutes ago, NJPLP said:

I know Mike would know what "Xero Reborn's" actual demo name is. We should ask him what the actual name of the demo is.

 

It sounds very similar to the start of Could Have Been for me. This just says one of two things for me.
1.) It is an unknown Xero song
2.) If it is Could Have Been there is probably a version with Mark on vocals

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It's not Could Have Been. I get why you say it sounds similar, and it kind of does stylistically, but it's a completely different melody. Based on how Phoenix does a slight variation and Mike says "Wow, you really do know the whole song", I would guess that he was playing the guitar part for the verses of whatever song this is. 

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It very much sounds like the opening of Could Have Been to me lol but you do make sense on the variation Phoenix does. I guess we do need to ask Mike on stream for definitive answer.
Chester said he remembers singing on it and Mike said it dates to '97 (though he sounds slightly uncertain in the above clip). So, if it is an unheard song from '97 then there might be two different versions of it. One with Chester on vocals and one with Mark. Or, as Mike said, it didn't get pass the demo stage. Mark may never of recorded on it then and they could of tried bringing back once Chester joined only to again scrap it.

I'm in a tough situation where I can't actively watch Mike's streams so I hope someone gets to ask him about this. I have other questions I'd love to ask Mike but I guess I'll have to hold off a bit.

 

A lot of people have already said what I want to see as the next "holy grail" but I'll throw in my two cents. I want some more unreleased material and demos from Meteora and Minutes to Midnight. I'm also curious about Ricochet and another song I saw on BMI titled I'm Not The One. That's something i never heard of before.

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38 minutes ago, TheVeryLastDinosaur said:

A lot of people have already said what I want to see as the next "holy grail" but I'll throw in my two cents. I want some more unreleased material and demos from Meteora and Minutes to Midnight. I'm also curious about Ricochet and another song I saw on BMI titled I'm Not The One. That's something i never heard of before.

https://lplive.net/forums/topic/11802-new-linkin-park-song-im-not-the-one/

 

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I would love to see Mike release the pooch pound tape or even some relative degree tracks 

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